/vr/ — >had the internet, an mmo, and a handheld console built into

>>12620674 (OP)
>were DVDs that powerful?
Yes. It was the only reason at least half of the people who bought a PS2 bought it, if not closer to 80%.

You have to understand that everyone was real fed up with sony after the ps1 and the ps2 was doomed to failure until sony made a bunch of behind-the-scenes deals with the porn industry to convince them to adopt the dvd as the standard. And as we all know, pornography is the real driving force behind home video sales. That's the only reason the ps2 was considered a success at all (it wasn't really, but thats another story).

Sony literally bent the space-time continuum to screw Sega and used dirty tricks like DVD's to sell the PS2, anyone around at the time knew everyone thought the 'Cast was better but felt forced to buy a PS2 because Sony made everyone stop making VHS. Don't even get me started on how they fked over the Saturn which by all means should have been the biggest console ever. If I told you what Sony did most of you wouldn't be able to handle it.

>>12620674 (OP)
sega tarnished their reputation with the 32X and Saturn
PSX was a household name and the PS2 was on the horizon

>>12620674 (OP)
The great insidious dvd jews came from outerspace and randomly picked ken kutaragi to sabotage sega and crown the ps2 as the king of consoles

>>12620706
>sega tarnished their reputation with the 32X and Saturn
and Pico, Nomad, TeraDrive, LaserActive
No game dev was gonna touch Sega ever again. Pretty much everyone who relied on Sega before went out of business. They could have given devkits away for free - there were no takers.

>>12620706
you mean Sega of America.

Sega of Japan was doing fine.

>>12620723
but the dreamcast had many quality 3rd party games coming out pretty much out of the gate?

>>12620674 (OP)
>all those words for a console which ultimately had games which looked worse than its generational cohorts
>the stock controller was novelty for the sake of novelty
>most people never made use of the VMU functionality beyond dicking around with a Chao for a couple weeks
I got a DC at launch and enjoyed it, but I wood of felt left out had it been my only console of the generation. It was awesome when it was the first home console with actually good 3D graphics, though of course it was quickly outclassed by the other consoles of the generation, not to mention most of its exclusives wound up being cool novelties which couldn't really compare to the caliber of exclusives on the other three consoles.

>>12620674 (OP)
Sega had great consoles but managed their market poorly.

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>>12620674 (OP)
It didn't lose because it was a bad console but simply Sega had raped it's reputation into the ground with the poor sales of the Saturn, commercial failure of the 32x and constant internal bickerings and failure to really expand their flagship franchises to their truest potential. The Dreamcast is a fantastic console however and Sega really pushed it to be more than just for games.

>>12620674 (OP)
The PS2 was a direct path upgrade for the 100 million existing PS1 owners. Not only did they get the new console and DVD player, but it played all the games they already had.

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>people bought the PS2 just for the DVD

>>12621885
Yeah this has always been revisionist bullshit. The Dreamcast wouldn’t have been 'saved' by having a DVD drive. The PS2 was the successor to the best selling console of all time in addition to being able to play DVDs.

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>>12620674 (OP)
>i will never understand how the dreamcast lost
I too pretend to be too stupid to not understand that a brand that came from releasing three failures in a row didn't exactly instill confidence in the consumer.
Fuck I think I prefer to argue with actual bots than "humans" making these threads constantly.

>>12621885
2000

DVD Player
-only DVD Player
> 250$

Playstation 2
-PS2 games player
-PS1 games player
-DVD Player
>299$

>>12620674 (OP)
4 levels of pso and lv 2hundred is all you needed op

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>>12620674 (OP)
Dreamcast is way better than Saturn. Sadly it wasn't enough against the giants.
C'est la vie.

The Dreamcast was like a better version of the 3DO. Impressive for the time and first to market, but once other similar consoles were released, it was immediately outclassed.

>>12620674 (OP)
With the exception of VGA output, the Saturn has the exact same features and if the Neptune had launched with its integrated modem the Dreamcast would have been a second gen online console

Sega was so ahead of the curve God himself smited them

>>12620674 (OP)
>had the internet
Majority of people didn't have internet
>an mmo
An awful one. Online gaming = pc
>a handheld console built into the controller itself
Silly and dumb gimmick. It just breaks the immersion. Imagine having to stop to look at an ugly little screen instead of being totally immersed in the game
>>480p progressive scan and VGA (now HDMI with adapters) output
99% of households had that crap composite 480i tv.

Of course it lost.
Let alone the fact that most of its games were just PS1 ports. Definitely a 5.5th gen console.

>>12621913
Dreamcast 2 (aka Xbox) has dvd, is more powerful, had better cost to price value and was backed by Microsoft (a company with infinite money). Even so, still lost.

>>12622313
>Dreamcast 2 (aka Xbox) has dvd, is more powerful, had better cost to price value and was backed by Microsoft (a company with infinite money). Even so, still lost.
Beat the gamecube even though the gamecube marketed worldwide and xbox basically only sold in north america

>>12620727
>Sega of Japan was doing fine.
fine not selling any Mega Drives that is. Heyo!

>>12622319
To call the loss of billions a win is stretching it way too far.

>>12620723
> Nomad
> TeraDrive
These are just variant forms of existing platforms. They caused no damage.

I have to imagine that a lot of people who seriously wonder why the DC lost weren't alive, or were at least extremely young, when these systems were current, so they've only ever known the entirely of the 6th gen console lineup as similarly outdated hardware with dat retro feel. Dreamcast was cool and had its diehard fans and some decent exclusives, but anybody who was serious about gaming could tell pretty quickly that the DC was relegated to second system status almost as soon as the PS2 (and eventually the GC and XBOX) came out.
I would be shocked if anybody thought "A PS2, huh? Nah dude, I don't need one, I've already got a Dreamcast."

>>12620674 (OP)
It wasn't DVD's that killed the Dreamcast. It was piracy through CD-R's, no thanks to the Utopia Boot Disc.

>An MMO
PSO isn't an MMO

>>12620674 (OP)
controller was not versatile enough

>>12620674 (OP)
>internet
console gamers did not care at the time
>mmo
see above
>handheld console built into the controller
ackshually it wasnt built in, it was sold separately and inserted in. neat idea but it ultimately was a gimmick without much utility. using it to call plays in football so your opponent couldnt see was nice though
>technobabble
people cared even less about all this stuff

>nooo... it was great, trust me, but it still failed, idk why
>omg, so unfair...
Threads like this is shitposting. Trying to rewrite history is shitposting

>>12620674 (OP)
Cope and seethe sega fans

>>12622351
they up for it temporarily with the 360

>>12622524
Xbox360 ? A console with a 50% failure rate ?That certainly earned them billions in return.

The Dreamcast had one of the least pretentious libraries of any console, i can't say the same about Sony consoles.

Reputation is extremely hard to come back from, Atari lost it and failed, Sega lost it and failed, now time will see if Xbox can get any of theirs back. Only miracles really has been Wii and again with Switch for Nintendo.

>>12622553
Agreed. Which is exactly why I loved the Dreamcast.

>>12622313
>Dreamcast 2 (aka Xbox) has dvd, is more powerful, had better cost to price value and was backed by Microsoft (a company with infinite money). Even so, still lost.
You had to buy a remote control and a receiver separately to play movies on it, and it came out a full year later at a higher price. Microsoft also had no real history with games outside of Solitaire and Flight Simulator and had to shell out millions for Halo just to be able to say they had games.

>>12622581
Nintendo never really damaged their reputation even in gens where their consoles did not sell well. Even people who thought Nintendo was just for kids acknowledged that they produced well made games.

>>12622313
>Majority of people didn't have internet
>>12622395
>console gamers did not care at the time
Yes, but they would have cared a few years later, if Dreamcast had survived beyond 2001 and not been replaced by the Xbox (where online play was relevant). So the point of the argument is that it's evidence that the Dreamcast had the juice to be successful, if it weren't for (what that anon believes to be) the fatal flaw.
(Personally I don't really think DVD would have made that much of a difference and probably would have created delays that made everything worse, if anything. But the point that it has perfectly good online support, that people are still using to this day, with revived 3rd party servers, is a good and relevant one.)

>>12620723
The Pico didn't damage Sega's reputation and was quite successful in Japan, it was less successful in America but the market for electronic eductainment devices exploded about a year after the Pico was discontinued in the region.

>>12622370
>anybody who was serious about gaming could tell pretty quickly that the DC was relegated to second system status almost as soon as the PS2 (and eventually the GC and XBOX) came out.
>I would be shocked if anybody thought "A PS2, huh? Nah dude, I don't need one, I've already got a Dreamcast."
The gap between Dreamcast and the later Gen 6 consoles is similar to the gap between Playstation and N64, yet the N64 sold far fewer units. And in fact, that is one of the reasons why it was always unlikely the Dreamcast would take over the next generation; the deck was already stacked in Sony's favor for that round, while Sega came in with a weak hand by the same measure. But imagining that didn't matter, the DC's relatively weaker ability to push polygons wasn't an obstacle to it racking up big sales during its period of exclusivity, attracting the most 3rd party attention, and leaving the competition with a vastly smaller potential market when they eventually arrived.

>>12622553
This is why it failed, by the time of its release the idea of "the arcade at home" become irrelavent

>>12622780
There were more than 24 million Xbox consoles sold worldwide and only 2 million Xbox live accounts in 2005. Online was a cool feature, but a vast majority of players didn't use it until the 360 and PS3.

>>12620741
Over a third of the NA launch titles were some kind of racing game. 2 football games. A decent amount of the launch titles were midway games.

>>12622789
No, it failed because of piracy. CD-R's were the nails to Dreamcast's coffin.

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>>12622875
>Dreamcast failed because of piracy
>Sony succeeded because of piracy

>>12622875
Ripping games was very difficult prior to Utopia's bootdisk, and that bootdisk was released in late June 2000. DC only had about 8 months of life left by that point (discontinued at the end of March 2001).
It was a factor in Sega pulling the plug, but not the main one. People simply weren't interested. If demand for DCs were high, they could've just produce consoles without MIL-CD functionality (they actually did that for a short while in Japan).

>released TWO expensive consoles that both flopped almost immediately and got very little support prior to dreamcasts release
>on the back of PS1 getting insanely good exclusives, with everyone hyping for the PS2
>couldn't play DVD's, like the PS2 could
>was significantly technically inferior to consoles that were releasing not a year after them
>anyone with real interest playing games online in 1999 had a PC anyway
>anything decent like RE: code veronica, shenmue and sonic got ported to other consoles after its death
I love the dreamcast, it was the only console I had growing up, but it just so happens to be competing with a games console that outmatched it in every aspect and had a library 2000x it's size.
why is it any surprise it died so quickly ?
its not even a "underrated" console, it was just okay in a time where games consoles just so happened to be at their peak.

>>12622313
>Majority of people didn't have internet
It had a dial-up modem. If you had a phone land line, you had the means to use the internet with the Dreamcast.

>>12623860
This, the Dreamcast didn’t require a third party ISP to connect to Sega Net.

>>12622875
There were several nails in that coffin already. Eliminating piracy would not have *saved* the Dreamcast. You guys are delusional about this stuff.

>>12620674 (OP)
>>12620678
yeah i specifically remember when ps2 was new and the DVD player was a huge deal because DVD players in general were still a very new thing and most people still had their VCRs.

PS2's console just had a better design that still looks nice today, the Dreamcast just looks kind of dated.

also, the Dreamcast's controller was lacking big time with just a single analog stick.

>>12622896
Who wuz this mil house cd guy he musta be the reason why all Ps2 CD painted bleu

>>12623896
The Dreamcast controller is straight up bad. Cheap feeling plastic, no built-in rumble, bad d-pad. Nothing about it feels premium in any way unlike the DualShock 2.

>>12623907
But but it gota ur beloved 4 players front panels and it can be plugged off with a stronger pull

>>12622881
>Sony succeeded because of piracy
Fake news. Sony had a lot of "Greatest Hits" titles due to running out of copies of the original games. Piracy wasn't widespread for the PS1 because you needed a mod chip, and not many were willing to brick their consoles with a mod chip that they would have to solder in. Nice try piratefag.

>>12622896
You can deny it all you want, but 8 months is more than enough time to kill the Dreamcast. Scaring away publishers, while also making it stupid easy for pirates to pirate games while taking the sales for legit copies, the very same legit copies that were needed to be sold to keep Sega afloat. Without those software sales, the Dreamcast was doomed and had a quick early demise rather than a continuation. If people weren't interested, then they wouldn't bother pirating the games.

>>12623895
Wrong. The nails were the pirated copies in the form of CD-R's, which was ultimately what killed the Dreamcast. The real delusion is claiming that piracy is what made the PS1 a success.

>it was cause of muh dvds!
why does /vr/ feel the need to invent slightly-wrong-revisionism for history a lot of us actually lived through? everyone I know bought the thing because:
a. they already had a PS1 and wanted the new shit
b. they wanted the MGS2 demo
c. "nintendo is for babies!"
or some combination of the three. DVDs were just a nice added bonus that landed it in some technology saavy boomer entertainment stands.

>>12624121
>you see, the Dreamcast actually would’ve been a huge success if everything happened exactly the way I’ve come up with in my imagined scenario

Delusional.